London Symphonies - "And on the eighth day God created pie and mash"

I had to laugh. I was in a rather swanky bar recently. I was waiting to meet someone and was a bit  bored. I started earwigging, listening to a rather posh chap chtting to a most attractive lady, of Eastern European ancestry (at a guess). As he had enjoyed a few glasses of wine, he was quite loud, so even though I'm deaf I couldn't help but hear. He suggested dinner, in reply, she said it would be nice to try some "real London food" whilst she was in town. He replied "Ha ha ha, there is no such thing! In London, we have the best food from everywhere else, France, Italy, China, India, everywhere, so we never bothered inventing our own dishes". I immediately thought "what is wrong with this dimwit, does he know nothing?". I felt a compelling urge to put this uneducated braggart in his place, but as I have a wife who I am most happy with, taking young ladies from Eastern Europe out for a meal is probably not a sensible idea. Now I am guessing that having read the title of the blog, you probably know what I am talking about. The food of London is Pie and Mash, served in a proper pie and mash shop. Most of these are only open for lunch and shut by 5pm. Proper pies are made of mincemeat, have a slightly burnt crust. The mash should be creamy, without lumps and it should be served in Liquor, a green parsley sauce. If you are doing it properly, you add chilli vinegar and pepper. You eat it with a spoon and fork. If you use a knife, you will be recognised as a novice or a fraud. The more sensible of us will have a two pie serving. This will keep you going all day. Pie and mash shops are not glamourous. They are for working people who want unfussy, tasty and filling food. It is the one cuisine that you really can't go wrong with. It does what it says on the tin and the established Pie and Mash shops in London know what they are doing and quality is always good.

Now it may surprise you to know that I was not raised on pie and mash. In fact I was in my late teens before I first tried it. It was a long journey, but I think my pie and mash story is worth recounting. I live in Mill Hill and this is not pie and mash country. My Dad was an Aussie from the outback, who loved his food and for him, a big steak, which was burned to a cinder was a good dinner. If he ate out, he wanted huge portions of meat or he wasn't really happy. Mum was a Northerner, from Lancashire, who aspired to be posh and she wasn't a fan of working mens cafe's. She had hoped, I think, that her youngest (me) would grow up to be a man of education, elegance, refinement and taste. Sadly, my elder sister Caroline tried to flush me down the bog at three months, having half strangled me on the way. My mother assumed she'd dropped me on my head on the way, so I grew up dyslexic, stupid and rather difficult to get along with. Dad quickly recognised that I was an idiot with no sense and no taste, for Mum the penny took longer to drop. 

As our family were Roman Catholics, Friday was fish and chip day. Dad would return after work, with large boxes of steaming fish and chips, which his six hungry kids greedily devoured. Then, at some point in the mid 1960's, the Pope abolished the fish on Friday rule. Dad informed us that we didn't have to have fish. He took me along "to help" and to choose. Now I loved fish and chips, but I fancied a change, so I ordered a steak and kidney pie. Dad warned me "not much meat in them son". He stuck with fish. When we got home, I hungrily devoured the pie and loved it. From that day forth, for me, Friday was pie and chips day. It became a family joke. I can recall being in Budgens in Mill Hill with my mum. I spotted a Frey Bentos steak and kidney pie in a tin and asked mum if we could have it for dinner. She didn't approve of such things. She wouldn't buy it. I saved up my pocket money and bought it myself. Mum told me I'd be disappointed when I ate it. I wasn't, I loved it. She was horrified. I think this was the moment that she joined my Dad in concluding I was an idiot. From then, a pie was my ultimate idea of a treat. Even for pudding, the only thing I really enjoy is an apple pie, with custard. I hate cheesecakes (plates of gunge), things with chocolate in (too sickly) and worst of all tapioca and semolina (I have the scars from school dinners). 

I also developed fixed ideas of what a pie is. It has to have pastry top and bottom. If it doesn't, then it isn't a pie, it is a stew with pastry on top. The top should be crispy and the bottom soggy and with a taste of suet. So I think you've established that I like a pie. As a teenager, I took to hanging around Camden Town, with a gang of punks. This was around 1977-9. There was one girl I was particularly fond of. I can't recall the exact date, but I ended up crashing at her place, which was a squat in Camden after a gig. We woke up in the late morning and I was starving hungry. I suggested breakfast. She said it was lunchtime. As I'd just done a decorating job, I was flush with money and offered to buy her lunch at the place of her choosing. She said "You ever been to the pie and mash shop?". I hadn't. So we walked around the corner to what I now know was Castles. The menu was simple. Pie and mash. No ifs, no buts. Most cafes youd get a choice, but here it was simple. You came here because you wanted pie and mash. Now I was a big fan of pie and I didn't mind mash. I was also starving hungry, so I ordered a triple pie and mash. She had a single. When it came, I was given a fork and spoon and it was covered in green gunk. She advised me to add some pepper and vinegar, which I did. The pies looked amazing but I wasn't sure about the green gunk. On the other hand, I was starving. I took a bit of pie and some of the gunk and Praise the Lord! It was  delicious. I scoffed down the three pies in the time it took her to have three spoonfuls. We washed it down with a nice cup of tea.

Now I have to be honest here. I was rather besotted with this young lady, so I didn't really take in any of the details, the location of the pie shop or anything else. But it was a magical day for me. To my disappointement, she was going off to Uni shortly and things fizzled out, but my brain was hard wired to love pie and mash from that second forth. London used to be awash with pie and mash shops, but sadly every year one or two close. Mill Hill is a pie and mash free zone, we are all to snobby around here. When I worked in town, I'd always locate a good one as a refuge for lunch. I could escape from my colleagues for an hour. It was always a joy, one I tried to keep to myself. Until 2017, before I stopped working in Central London to concentrate on my studio business. I got out of the habit of crafty visits down to Manze's on Tower Bridge Road, or whichever one was nearest. Since I stopped having easy access, as I now work in Mill Hill, I'd sort of forgotten this guilty pleasure. 

Fortunately my Guardian Angel took me to Oxford City FC with a coachload of Hadley FC supporters in the FA Trophy late last year. At the ground, I had the best steak pie with mash I'd had for years. I mentioned this to a chap called Alan, a fellow supporter and we got onto the subject of pie and mash. He told me that he was a member of a Pie and Mash Appreciation group on Facebook. I was fascinated. On returning home, I immediately joined. One of the first posts I saw was one asking about a pie and mash shop in Borehamwood called Chloe's. Sadly my research lead me to the sad news that it had gone. Unperturbed , I found that there was a cafe called the Brick Lane Bagel Co in the town, which served proper pie and mash. As we had some shopping to do, a stop there seemed like a very good idea. 

I took Clare, promising a tasty bagel (their selection of bagelks looked pretty good, she doesn't eat meat so pie and mash is a no no). Anyway, we went there. I feigned surprise at pie and mash, not that it fooled her. As we went in a chap in Halfords overalls asked if I was there for the pie and mash and recommended the double pie offer. To Clare's annoyance and amusement, he asked if I wanted two plates. I said  "No, just one, she's having a bagel". To her even greater annoyance, he cocked the order up and gave me three pies, having only charged for two. They were wonderful. I realised what I'd been missing. I realised that there was  a London Symophony in the key of pie! So a grand journey started. 

Castles Pie and Masg

The more I thought about it, the more I realised that I needed to make a pilgrimmage to Castle's in Camden Town, where I first fell in love with pie and mash. As I now have a freedom pass, I can do this on my day off. It is only twenty minutes away on the Thameslink and the bus. I found myself back where it all started, two pies and a mug of tea. I swapped a joke with an ambulance crew and for a few short minutes I was in heaven. I got soaked on the walk from the bus stop to the pie emporium, which simply made the pies taste better. God was with me! It got me thinking of the other pie and mash shops I've frequented over the years. 

When I was 20, I worked for a chain of stores called Derek Cousins Discount Stores. They had a large shop in Peckham Rye, which was located conveniently across from a pie shop called Simple Simons. The pie and mash was superb there. However the locals immediately clocked my North London accent and I always felt the eyes of the world were on me. No one was ever hostile, but unlike Camden, when you nodded and said Hi to the customers, they would draw on their roll ups and stare at their copy of The Sun. There was a lovely Carribean lady who worked in the shop. She explained that they assumed I was a Policeman checking out some of the villains that ate in there. She sensibly observed "No one comes from North London to eat pie and mash at Simple Simons". 

This was confirmed, when a rather colourful local character called Sid Turner rented some workshops from my Dad in Bunns Lane Works. Sid was originally from South East London and was what we used to call "a bit of a geezer". My Dad got on with well with Sid, who was always good for a laugh, even if there were suspecions not all of his wealth was legally acquired. Dad liked the fact that Sid was always prepared to try his hand starting new businesses. Sid started what is now The Bunns Lane Car wash, which is still running to this day, albiet with Kosovan ownership. 

I was chatting to Sid one day in the mid 1980's and he mentioned that his favourite restaurant was a pie shop in Peckham. I asked if it was called Simple Simons and he was amazed I knew it. I told him the story of how I got the cold shoulder there. He said "Yeah that was probably me, we were always on the lookout for coppers and grasses poking their noses in". I agreed with him that it was a great place. I joked to him that he should start a Simple Sid's in Burnt Oak. He looked at me and said "That's a brilliant idea", withing six months he'd set it up. He told me that as it was my idea, I could have a free pie and mash anytime I wanted if he was around. Sadly, it only lasted a few years, but it was much loved by the customers. Sid got into property renovations and one of the many crashes cleaned him out and ended the cafe and most of his other enterprises. Happily he bounced back, but never reopened the pie and mash shop. I recall watching Sid chin one of the locals, after they suggested that he was an old man and past it in the cafe. Sid came up to me and apologised for disturbing my dinner, but I replied normally I had to pay for such entertainment and we had a giggle. I was delighted to spot a tweet discussing it on Twitter back in 2017!

@RobertElms I've been trying to find the name of a former pie & mash shop in Burnt Oak which was run by Sid Turner. https://t.co/Q54zzMWQ0S

— Mike Goldwater (@OldSpeckledMike) June 10, 2017

Which brings us to the final stop on this tour. As I mentioned, in more recent times, my favourite pie and mash shop was Manze's on Tower Bridge Road. I've not been there since 2012, when I was working near Tower Bridge, so I thought I'd make a trip down.  A good mate of mine, Mick lives down that way, so I thought I'd meet him there. Being a Northerner, I was worried that he wouldn't get proper London food, but it was a good chance to catch up.

Manze's was just how I remember it. I suspect that almost nothing has changed in decades (apart from the prices). The sign displaying the prices is one of the peg board type signs, so not even a new sign is required when prices change. 

They have a Hall of Fame gallery above the prices, with a signed picture of Roy Orbison taking pride of place. Like all good pie and mash shops, the building is tiled with white and green tiles. 

Everything is functional and huge numbers of pies are dispensed during the course of a day. When I used to work near Tower Bridge, I'd sneak down once a week. I knew a few of the regulars. Once, I was sitting there tucking into my dinner and a fellow sat opposite me and tried to strike up a conversation. After a few pleasantries were exchanged, he said "Tell me, is Jesus in your life?". I don't really like talking to people about my beliefs, not least because generally when people start conversations like this, they don't want to hear my beliefs, they want to explain how their own are superior.

My response took him by surprise. I replied "Yes, Jesus walks every step of the way with me". He was a bit surprised and said "What do you mean?" I replied "He's sitting here with us now, as we speak. Did you know that if Jesus had been a cockney, he'd the last supper would've been pie, mash and a cup of tea?". The chap looked horrified and said "You shouldn't joke about such things, God takes a dim view of people who do not respect him". I replied "I have ultimate respect for God, he has blessed us with many gifts and to me the greatest of all is being able to eat pie and mash in peace and quiet". My new friend got the message. 

I do genuinely believe that when Jesus returns, you'll be far more likely to find him having a pie and mash with his mates, than in swanky restaurants. I don't know if his Dad, God, created pie and mash on the eighth day, once the world was done. What I do know is that it is an honest, simple pleasure should be cherished. As I get older, I've learned to appreciate things, especially things that I love that seem to be slipping away. I feel the need to write a song and make a video that will do justice to my love of our pie and mash shops, but every time I've tried it has turned out a bit too Chas and Dave for my liking. I will get there one day though!

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